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Thread: Is Art a Waste of Time

  1. #51
    Senior Member Chosen Agent2090's Avatar
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    *sigh* Thread's probably going to be locked. But I'll try to help it get back on track.

    The point of contention here seems to be that people are unable to agree on what is or isn't art. LoudAndAnnoying, I'd like to pose this question to you:

    What would you consider an example of art?

    Maybe you've said it and I skimmed over it by mistake, but a clear on concise answer would be very helpful in moving the discussion along beyond insults.

    You have said in this thread that art conveys a message or emotion:

    Quote Originally Posted by LoudAndAnnoying View Post
    They say art's supposed to be expression, convey a message, if it doesn't convey the message well, it's not good art. If something takes explanation to most people, it's probably just bad art.
    Quote Originally Posted by LoudAndAnnoying View Post
    Art is probably best defined as a way of conveying a message or emotion, failure to do so, is bad art.
    Though a failure in the conveyance of the message doesn't seem to exclude it from being art, it's just bad.

    _

    And this is probably your most clear definition of what you think art is:

    Quote Originally Posted by LoudAndAnnoying View Post
    While I understand that there is the common analogy of comparing a player's pitch or other technique to an art form, I wouldn't consider it an art form. As for art only needing to mean something to the beholder, I can't agree with that definition. The view of a mountain may be preferred to a painting of one by someone, but it would not be considered a work of art.

    Art needs to have a creator, that's one clear prerequisite. Art also needs to effectively convey something through it, an emotion or an idea, that's where a baseball pitch falls short, while a game may be emotionally charged and involve strategy, it is not in itself a way to convey thought or emotion. Last I'd say art needs to last, a painting can last hundreds of years, a book can be read an infinite number of times, it needs to be something that is repeatable to a degree, songs can be sung again, nothing that only exists in the moment is considered art, as art needs to come from intent, not happenstance, in essence part of art is a way to come closer to quantifying and understand an emotion or thought, so it has to last.
    A movie, TV show, or even - I hesitate to say it, but in an effort to remain consistent to what has been discussed in this thread, I will - an anime can meet the criteria you listed above. So I'm slightly confused on where you draw the line.

    So if I could get a clear view on your position, maybe this discussion can move beyond "this is art/no it isn't" and maybe reach some kind of conclusion.

    You mention books in the quote above, are there books you do not consider to be art? (Excluding, for example, reference or research type books)

    Or maybe a better question would be, what is an example of a book that you consider art?
    Last edited by Agent2090; 10-04-2015 at 07:42 AM.
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    Senior Member Chosen BlueFast's Avatar
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    Here's an amazing video, not sure if it's been posted yet:

    Art is a hard thing to determine because it is now based on opinion.

    Like I don't consider this art:



    Quote Originally Posted by RippleApple View Post
    Music Appreciation was a required course at my college.

    Not only a waste of time, but a waste of money. NOTHING to do with my majors.
    Art appreciation is a skill you are born with, and a skill that can be developed, not learned.

    With the majors thing, there's another debate that'd be interesting to start: When you can start choosing your own classes in school.

    Quote Originally Posted by ImAeternalis View Post
    Art doesn't have a definition.

    When people think that this can be defined as art, I lose all touch with any variation of its definition.

    Is that literally just an hour of white noise? And some say it's art? HAHAHA
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  3. #53
    Senior Member Honoured LoudAndAnnoying's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent2090 View Post
    A movie, TV show, or even - I hesitate to say it, but in an effort to remain consistent to what has been discussed in this thread, I will - an anime can meet the criteria you listed above. So I'm slightly confused on where you draw the line.

    So if I could get a clear view on your position, maybe this discussion can move beyond "this is art/no it isn't" and maybe reach some kind of conclusion.

    You mention books in the quote above, are there books you do not consider to be art? (Excluding, for example, reference or research type books)

    Or maybe a better question would be, what is an example of a book that you consider art?
    Hypothetically an anime could be artistic, but in reality no. Anime is a fad, produced vastly predominately because it is a current fad. Making anime makes you and your crap popular for no reason, and that's the main reason behind making anime, not artistic value. I can't entirely rule out the existence of a single artistic anime, but if it does exist, it's the exception not the rule, by a vast, vast margin.

    But to make statements like "Anime is art," that's a vast misappropriation of the word art.

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    Otaku Mod Infamous MiyobiKumagawa's Avatar
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    Certain anime fits the criteria of art. Post modernism art evolves over time as technology progresses. What seems to be a fad in your eyes becomes something else when done correctly. Of course those that continue to see it as a fad will deny it unless presented with examples within a context.

    Comic books were regarded as childish nonsense until works like Watchmen brought it into the realm of artistic modernism due to its story and characters.

    Miyazaki and his anime works pretty much were stepping stones for anime to evolve into art. Is all anime art? Depends if it fits within the criteria of story, visual effects, development, and ethics.

    High School of the Dead isn't art, but Clannad is. Suzumiya Haruhi isn't art, but Ef - A Tale of Melodies is defined into art. Anime is taking step by step into the art world due to Miyazaki's success and build upon that with more and more creative works.

    Same context is happening to video games. When Final Fantasy 7 hit the stage of the video game world started bringing the context of artistic video games.

    Art evolves and changes the criteria as time progresses. The meaning of art warps and adapts to ongoing trends. People hate change, but adapting to the meaning of said change causes art of expand.
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    Senior Member Infamous Trubblegum's Avatar
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    When you think about it, every human action is futile and holds no true sway in the order of the Universe. Everything can be seen as a waste of time.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trubblegum View Post
    When you think about it, every human action is futile and holds no true sway in the order of the Universe. Everything can be seen as a waste of time.
    Why is the order of the universe the end goal? Nothing will ever have a true point.
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    Senior Member Honoured LoudAndAnnoying's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MiyobiKumagawa View Post
    Art evolves and changes the criteria as time progresses. The meaning of art warps and adapts to ongoing trends. People hate change, but adapting to the meaning of said change causes art of expand.
    The meaning of art is warped to fit current trends. Big difference.
    Quote Originally Posted by MiyobiKumagawa View Post
    Certain anime fits the criteria of art. Post modernism art evolves over time as technology progresses. What seems to be a fad in your eyes becomes something else when done correctly. Of course those that continue to see it as a fad will deny it unless presented with examples within a context.
    No it's a fad. This isn't about my perception being prejudice, it's just a fad. The fact that it's a fad is perfectly illustrated by the fact that you draw a distinction between it and all other animation, people separate it and elevate it why? because it's somehow superior and distinct? No, it's obviously not, it's new, and it's cool because people say it's cool, and it's a fad.
    Quote Originally Posted by MiyobiKumagawa View Post
    Miyazaki and his anime works pretty much were stepping stones for anime to evolve into art. Is all anime art? Depends if it fits within the criteria of story, visual effects, development, and ethics.
    God damn, changed the definition of art again.

    Quote Originally Posted by MiyobiKumagawa View Post
    High School of the Dead isn't art, but Clannad is. Suzumiya Haruhi isn't art, but Ef - A Tale of Melodies is defined into art. Anime is taking step by step into the art world due to Miyazaki's success and build upon that with more and more creative works.
    Again, no reasons offered, it just is cause you say so, your opinion is "fact."

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    Otaku Mod Infamous MiyobiKumagawa's Avatar
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    *sigh* I'm not surprised you replied to my points with disappointing biased opinions without taking much into context and seeing it differently. It's a one sided debate that basically states, "You don't see it my way and all your opinions are what you said."

    I assume you've never taken an advance art course nor actually delved in post modernism art because if not then its a shame since the line of thinking will not change.

    There's no point in continuing a civil debate with you since you dislike listening to reason which I kindly presented in an order that you could have used in a viable context.

    Of course anything I say to you will end up with the same response from you every time.
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    Senior Member Prestigious Trisitella's Avatar
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    "anime isnt art"

    Then what the fuck is Madoka Magica, Akira, ANY Miyazaki movie?!?!
    Both the story and the background are amazingly designed.

    To say that the art in ANY of those is not art, shows total ignorance.
    Last edited by AlexError; 10-05-2015 at 04:37 PM. Reason: removed image
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    Forum Moderator Honoured AlexError's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trisitella View Post
    "anime isnt art"

    Then what the fuck is Madoka Magica, Akira, ANY Miyazaki movie?!?!
    Both the story and the background are amazingly designed.

    To say that the art in ANY of those is not art, shows total ignorance.
    This is serious discussion - avoid posting memes or caption replies in the form of images.
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