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Thread: Defense

  1. #11
    Senior Member Infamous Myrkulyte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AttackDamageCry View Post
    In joust there are only a few ways to win. Snowball a lead and force an f6. Backdoor or Siege. No matter how you look at it, for every God in the game, objectives are important. With certain Gods you just have a timer ticking down until that God loses all real relevance.

    It's the same as Bakasura, yeah his early game is scary and it's easy to snowball a lead, but if you let it get past mid-game your only option is to backdoor because it's unlikely you'll be able to win a straight up engagement against a true late game carry/ hyper carry unless you outplay them.

    Chaac can't really backdoor, but he can siege. He can tank tower/ phoenix shots for a while with his heal, also allows him to constantly push and pressure the lane which in turn stops the opponent from pushing. Healing up poke is also really strong.

    So I feel like you tried to win the kills game as opposed to accepting Chaac's inevitable shortcomings late-game as opposed to really going for the objective game when ultimately, objectives are more important than kills, that's just how joust is.

    And that's sort of reflected in your build. You tried to fight him, you tried to keep up. To keep up with an AMC who's building crit, you also need crit, otherwise you just won't hit as hard. The whole time you're fighting he's going to be passively healing through his hives while pewpewing phat crits on you. And even if you build crit, that doesn't guarantee anything, you would still have to rely on the fact that your damage is easier to confirm than his.

    Ultimately I'd say, at that point in the game, don't fight him, just go for objectives. More physical defense, more penetration in the form of Titan's Bane and really just fight for the objectives, not for the kills that allow you to get objectives. Just for objectives.

    As for Jotunn's.. I don't really agree with it on Chaac at all. Jotunn's gives you Pen, Mana, CDR and Physical Power. Great item.

    Except...

    Chaac doesn't need flat pen because he's typically AA based not ability based.
    Chaac doesn't need mana, he has a passive based around mana management and sustain.
    Chaac doesn't need CDR because first point.
    Chaac doesn't need THAT much physical power because ultimately most of his damage will come from Qin's as opposed to his actual AA's. I know this is debatable as his 3 also scales with physical power, but that's just my opinion (there are also better ways to get physical power).

    I feel Chaac is scary when he's un-killable. When he has so much defense and so much regeneration that you just can't deal with him even as he's under your tower ramming it down. Either that or you have to keep up in terms of damage, but with your build in that game you weren't able to do either of those things as you prioritized attack and move speed too highly over actual damage and objective push which in the end fucked you over. I'd bet you a lot of money a lot of your deaths were caused by Nemean, you were AAing so much so fast and probably hitting like a wet noodle in the process.
    Hmmmm, perhaps you are right. Guess it's time for another experience spike, my bad habits from G4 are still there. The strategy is what I need to work at it seems. Thank you for the explanations, I will reread your reply until I got it.

    Thank you

  2. #12
    Senior Member Infamous Myrkulyte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlexError View Post
    Scaling with power is linear (Bastet).
    Scaling with power and attack speed is quadratic. (Chaac).
    Scaling with power, attack speed and critical hit chance is cubic. (Rama).

    The pre-nerf Rage used to scale cubically, since it gave three separate stats. Never use exponential as a term to describe scaling; no god scales exponentially in Smite.
    But some gods(osiris/kali for example) scale with attack speed and on hit-effects, crit and power is essentially worthless for them. Full tank osiris(well 4 defense items +quinn's+pen boots) can beat chaac, hard

  3. #13
    Member Worshipper SpitefulOne's Avatar
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    It has nothing to do with God scaling per level. His statement is about how criticals act as a power multiplier. Chaac technically scales the same way if he were to use the critical build but then he'd be just as vulnerable as a hunter but require melee range. He actually has a higher base attack speed if you ignore the hive speed buff.

    Protections also has diminishing returns where you gain less damage resistance per point of protections gained. Executioner's and warrior tabis have enough penetration to basically negate 1 protection item if that's all you buy. And Chaac only has 6 additional points of physical protections compared to AMC at lvl 20 (when he doesn't have stacks from Torrent).

  4. #14
    Member Worshipper SpitefulOne's Avatar
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    Qin's isn't a great choice against AMC either since he doesn't have a huge health pool so it will only add on around 50 damage after taking AMC's protections and Chaac's jotun's and warrior tabi into account.

    Chaac does have an attack chain though so trying to take advantage of the 1.5x damage swing with a 2.5x crit could be interesting.

  5. #15
    Senior Member Infamous Myrkulyte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpitefulOne View Post
    Qin's isn't a great choice against AMC either since he doesn't have a huge health pool so it will only add on around 50 damage after taking AMC's protections and Chaac's jotun's and warrior tabi into account.

    Chaac does have an attack chain though so trying to take advantage of the 1.5x damage swing with a 2.5x crit could be interesting.
    I remember I was as chaac against an anhur, I critted harder than him

  6. #16
    Member Worshipper SpitefulOne's Avatar
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    Exactly, the 1.5x swings take better advantage of the crit multiplier. Gods with a lot of less than 1x swings (Kali, Osiris) use Qin's more effectively because the passive isn't impacted by the multiplier.
    Last edited by SpitefulOne; 01-01-2015 at 08:01 PM. Reason: Grammar

  7. #17
    Senior Member Honoured Ramenyolo's Avatar
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    Myr you got outplayed bro. Admit it. Lol!

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