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Thread: low damage as athena

  1. #31
    Senior Member Chosen RockerBaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Relanah View Post

    The only useless gods are aurabots who think they're so useful standing around providing a whopping 25 all prots to a team and maybe a CC once per 20 seconds because they went full "Support" so they have no damage, no pen, no decent CDR... Meanwhile, allied squishies who now have like 50-60 total prots are still getting melted if they're focused...

    )
    Really depends on the God. For Athena more tank is almost always better then some more damage in arena. The only exception is if your team is so bad they can't deal damage. Doesn't matter if you can solo zone some guy out at 50% their hp if you die when you manage to taunt 3 people. For conq sure maybe better to be able to zone one out by yourself, I have almost no games as athena in conq so I can't say.

    Also Athena is not the best aura bot, as she engages the enemy team pretty much alone most often (atleast in arena), all those auras do not benefit the team. Better as I said with pesti, void stone etc. Key to aura botting is knowing where you will most often be in the fights. Kehp for example does aura botting really well.

    As for playing aura bot I do this frequently, the key is mixing it up so you can support with it apart from just mitigating and body blocking. Gem of iso for example. Or when I play Geb/Kehp I build a chronos pendant almost every time. Spear of magus is also a favorite for me on kehp. I can have 3 def auras going and just build spear so that my mages do way more damage. Its like 50% more damage on their squish if they have someone with HW close by. So one item can add 50% dmg to my mage, pushing them from like 20k dmg to 30k dmg over a game done right. What is more useful? Building the kehp for dmg and go from 15k to like 25k while providing way less defense for team or just build items that increase your teams dps? In arena where 2 mage is frequent adding 50% dmg to both or dealing 50% more dmg yourself, it is an ez choice.

    For Ymir his base dmg so high a void stone and a deso is all that is needed to carry good dmg through all the game. But some games getting that extra deso item actually punishes you more then it helps. Rest you can aura up and winged blade ofc.

    Most often though one single aura def item is enough either sov or HW depening on what dmg they have that you need to mitigate for team. Personally I do not like the 10/10 aura item at all. I rather get gaia+mantle later. In some rare cases you need to mitigate both dmg types with auras. Witchblade is super good as well, some games. And some games all 3 are good to have. For example witchblade heavily impacts what an Au kuang wants to do in arena, add HW on that and he needs to counter build so hard you heavily impact his game. IF they also have a merc, that relies on AS and a herc+ho yi. that is a lot of phys aoe dmg that is pretty much impossible to stop going on your team and the only way to try mitigate it is building sover. I mean good luck "zoning out" this team with dmg, merc can ult through whole team without commit, herc can boulder without commit, ho yi can ult without commit. To not aura bot that game to avoid all team dying or all your team zoned out from a merc+herc ult is way better then you being able to zone out their hunter.

    Yesterday I played Anubis in arena. We had a baccus tank and they are often jumping into enemy team and I felt we needed another stable backliner that could peel and mitigate their zeus+cerb combo that is a lot of mag dmg that is hard to avoid. So I got HW first item, let our awilix and baccus combo do the main carry work and made it my job to keep our hel and medusa alive as a 2nd off tank. I got HW first item, then normal build with spear of magus for pen so hel and baccus could do more dmg. It worked excellent and we won. Late game I couldn't tank at all but early and mid we won almost every team fight cause their team couldn't put out enough dmg. What they needed was spear of magus on either cerb or zeus but they didn't get it. The feeling you get when someone get zeus combo on them and you just walk in and take 2 of the bounces from the shield and mitigate it with HW and your teammate runs away with 20% =)

    I think the most difficult thing on athena is, and thats something I am still struggling with, is to coordinate the taunt with your teammates. Say you get a good taunt off but your scylla isn't ready or you see the scylla in ult and low health enemies nearby but your taunt is still on CD.
    Yes and its more difficult in conq then in arena. I would say with experience you will know better. Keep eye on map, try get a feel for CDs, check ult timers etc before committing. And if you jungle sure start with some dmg items so you can farm, void stone maybe (does it still apply to creeps?) But if your team is derp, with squish support and squish solo you must build quite tanky mid and late game to have a functioning team.
    Last edited by RockerBaby; 09-19-2018 at 10:31 AM.
    Rocking the boat

  2. #32
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    notice disclaimer :
    _ i will probably tell something already written in previous pages , and this will be my own opinion about athena .
    ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯ ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯ ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯ ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯ ¯¯¯
    first of all athena damaging combo is army+attract (skill3 and shot + skill2 and shot _ i said shot cause you gain a ranged attack after skill dont waste it and anyway as there is a delay between skills you have time to)

    so_
    as this combo is close combat , void stone is THE item you need , it will also help your team to explode your potential victim ,)
    an other item which has an interest is stone of binding (rez+pops +15pen when CC _ skill2 is triggering it)

    after_
    here is my build for assault (auto item)
    _stone of gaia (always for tanks in assault whatever others can say about auras , noobs gotta get chronos pendent or mps if they need mana or wait for med) take note stone also gives +15hp in case of CC 60s cd which will be more and more interesting the more you grow in health
    _shaman's ring , as boots , and it is a fun item forcing you to be cautious in early game the time to complete the item's quest ,)
    _void stone , magik rez , aura and take note it gives hp
    _stone of binding , double rez and special effekt described previously
    _soul gem , cdr 30%dmg each 4stacks and heals (used cleverly it can boost your ult and save an ally [VEW][VVGN][VER]!!!)
    _mail of renewal , cdr hps and a cool passive %hp after kill or assist = you can rush if your victim dies you have a bonus for retreat ,)
    _relics : med , shell upp
    early game , as stone of gaia has some mps , you can use skills for nothing(in the wind) just to gain the ranged attack ±150dmg initially which is cool

    athena is mainly about positioning , and your capability to read teams potentials :
    skill2 attraction can be a game changer if used nicely ,
    skill3 your army has some 200~250dmg instant which is clearly a cool damaging skill for a tank and the best way to finish any lowered god you rush (and gain bonus from klilling ^^)
    ult , aah the ult , can help to rejoin the battle fast , and or to blast an enemy rushed by a teamate , or a clever m8 can catch the occasion to rush during preparation ,)

    athena cant really endure long fights , use her more like an assassin=force finisher "rush&bomb" or defender as you wanted to support , even if you dont get the kills yourself after a while your presence will induce a risk for the enemy team if you use your skill2 wisely ,)

    be fun using your ult you wont regret it

    good luck and have fun ,)
    Last edited by FRONTdeQUICHE; 09-19-2018 at 11:34 AM.

  3. #33
    The Mad Hatter Chosen Relanah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RockerBaby View Post
    Really depends on the God. For Athena more tank is almost always better then some more damage in arena. The only exception is if your team is so bad they can't deal damage. Doesn't matter if you can solo zone some guy out at 50% their hp if you die when you manage to taunt 3 people. For conq sure maybe better to be able to zone one out by yourself, I have almost no games as athena in conq so I can't say.
    A well built Guardian should be able to handle both situations. Hence "Bruiser" not "Full Damage" nor "Full Tank" but a mix. Enough defences to keep the frontline existing without folding over like paper when a damage dealer glances at you, but enough damage items to mean that you can still push out a surprising amount of damage because of Guardian/Warrior high base damage and good scaling.

    Especially on certain gods, like Athena, who's entire game plan is to taunt someone and have them die before it wears off or force their beads because they know they'll die before it wears off. Then, you wait a bit and do it again because 18s base CD taunt vs 160s base CD beads.

    As for playing aura bot I do this frequently, the key is mixing it up so you can support with it apart from just mitigating and body blocking. Gem of iso for example. Or when I play Geb/Kehp I build a chronos pendant almost every time. Spear of magus is also a favorite for me on kehp. I can have 3 def auras going and just build spear so that my mages do way more damage. Its like 50% more damage on their squish if they have someone with HW close by. So one item can add 50% dmg to my mage, pushing them from like 20k dmg to 30k dmg over a game done right. What is more useful? Building the kehp for dmg and go from 15k to like 25k while providing way less defense for team or just build items that increase your teams dps? In arena where 2 mage is frequent adding 50% dmg to both or dealing 50% more dmg yourself, it is an ez choice.
    What you've described there is not aura botting. You're building bruiser as you're taking some offensive items such as Iso, Chronos, Magus. Which aid your damage as well as providing some extra oomph to your kits.

    Aura botting is more doing what people oft think Supports should do which is buying Thebes, Sov, Heart, Shoguns, Emperor and being literally just there to stand there providing auras.

    When there are SO many good options to fill in 1-2 spots with more offensive items;

    Gem of Isolation, Ethereal Staff, Spear of the Magus, Divine Ruin, Pythagorem's Piece, Chronos' Pendant, Rod of Asclepius, Doom Orb, Obsidian Shard, Spear of Desolation.

    Not to mention all the useful hybrid items such as Stone of Binding, Void Stone, Celestial Legion Helm, Lotus Crown.

    (Also a fun interaction, Gem of Isolation means that any damaging skill will proc Stone of Binding)

    There's so little reason to not build at least a bit of power and pen into your Guardians as there are just so many good items that include those stats that can aid your team in far more ways than "Well, I can take 1 more basic attack from this 6 slotted Hunter" that stacking purely defensive items brings.
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  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by FRONTdeQUICHE View Post
    athena is mainly about positioning , and your capability to read teams potentials :
    skill2 attraction can be a game changer if used nicely ,

    good luck and have fun ,)
    i repeat cause they are debating about builds but ... any build aint cheese if you are not playing correctly , and athena precisely is a god that requieres a special way of playing _ it is not "just" ###

    i gave you a build for assault but after all you can use any build you like as long as you follow the line of conduct of athena [POSITION+TEAMPLAY+TEAM(z) ANALYSiS]

    if you have any kind of handicap using your brain or mouse+keyboard just dont pick it , whatever the build you use it wont help if you are an idiot .

    /!\ THIS IS IMPORTANT /!\
    Last edited by FRONTdeQUICHE; 09-19-2018 at 01:15 PM. Reason: come on blame the lagg

  5. #35
    Senior Member Chosen RockerBaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Relanah View Post
    There's so little reason to not build at least a bit of power and pen into your Guardians as there are just so many good items that include those stats that can aid your team in far more ways than "Well, I can take 1 more basic attack from this 6 slotted Hunter" that stacking purely defensive items brings.
    Alright we are on pretty much the same page. I wanna give Obs shard an extra shout out, few people build it on guardians. But in some games as someone like ymir, all you can hit is their front and then obs shard give u the punch needed for it to matter.
    Rocking the boat

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    note about guardians : they often have a big %bonus on skills , one item for damages is not a waste ,) so ... i agree 1000‰

    and in penetration item list , you have many items with rez+pen+dmg and even hp , hybrid tank is still very cool

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