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Thread: The murdering-est guardian 3.0

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    Senior Member Prestigious LuxInterior's Avatar
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    The murdering-est guardian 3.0

    So I've decided to update my list with the new additions. This time I'm just putting raw numbers so it's easy to compare the results of building full tank (remove about 30% of the raw damage), pen or power.

    Just for comparison: Ah Puch (5 ticks corpse, 10 hits ultimate, 3 corpses exploding) = 1800 + 320% or 2050 + 370% if target heals.

    Ares
    Shackle damage per tic: 105 + 15% Max ticks: 11 (3 from first, 3 from second, 5 from last shackle). Total 1115 + 165%
    Searing Flesh: 280 + 56% + 24% of the target's max Health (assuming a 2k health target = 480) = 760 +56%
    Ultimate: 500 + 40%

    Total: 2375 + 216%

    Artio
    Energy Surge: 190 + 35%
    Maul Prey: 160 + 30% (x2) 320 + 60%
    Life Tap: 275 + 50%
    Heavy Charge: 270 + 50%

    Total: 1055 + 195%

    Athena
    Pre-emptive Strike: 280 + 50%
    Shield wall: 560 + 100%
    Ultimate: 750 + 90%
    Reach: 65 x 4 + 4 x 15% = 60% (Counting base + 80%) = 120%

    Total: 1590 / 1850 + 300% / 420%

    Bacchus
    Bellyflop: 250 + 70%
    Belch: 320 + 60%
    Ultimate: 550 + 70%
    (Passive from ultimate can add 60 mp, 75 mp with Tahuti)

    Total: 1120 + 200%

    Cabrakan
    Seismic Crush: 280 + 50% + 68 + 20% (mandatory basic)
    Refraction Shield: 320 + 50%
    Tremors: 124 + 70% per second (consider 2 seconds: 248 + 140%)
    Ultimate: 550 + 70%

    Total: 1466 + 330%

    Cerberus
    Paralyzing Spit: 170 + 20% + 136 + 16% + 102 + 12% + 68 + 8% = 476 + 56%
    Ghastly Breath: (55 + 12.5%) X 7 = 385 + 87.5%
    Soul Expulsion: 220 + 60%
    Ultimate: 440+ 55%

    Total: 1321+ 261.5%

    Fafnir
    Cursed Strength: 250 + 50%
    Underhanded Tactics: 240 + 60%
    Ultimate: 480 + 120%
    Dragon Cursed Strenght: 390 + 75%
    Dragon Underhanded Tactics; 360 + 90%
    Base 1720 + 395% add 25% self-buff from Coerce
    (Also: 37% scaling per second on dragon's breath, but I'm not counting basics)

    Total: 2150 + 494%

    Ganesha
    Turn of Fate: 330 + 55%
    Remove Obstacles: 240 + 45%
    Ultimate: 255 + 40% (4 hits if you hold them on the border) = 1020 + 160%

    Total: 1580 + 260%

    Geb
    Roll out: 400 + 50
    Shock wave: 370 + 50
    Ultimate (2k health target): 700

    Total: 1470 + 100%

    Khepri
    Abduct: 280 + 40%
    Rising Dawn: 220 + 50%
    Solar Flare: 250 + 30%

    Total: 750 + 120%

    Kumbhakarna
    Throwback: 370 + 60%
    Groggy Strike: 270 + 50%
    Ultimate: 825 + 65%

    Total: 1465 + 175%


    Kuzenbo
    NeNe Kappa: 210 + 55% + 130 (2 NeNe hits, that's really low)
    Shell Spikes: anything
    Sumo Slam: 200 + 35% = Max 600 + 115%
    Ultimate: 280 + 40% (first hit) + 140 + 20% = 700 + 100% (4 hits)
    Total: 1640 + 270% + whatever reflect

    Sobek
    Charge prey: 230 + 50%
    Tail whip: 260 + 40%
    Sickening Strike: 220 + 30%
    Ultimate: 950 + 80%

    Total: 1660 + 200%

    Sylvanus
    Verdant Growth: 240 + 35%
    Whisps: 150 + 50%
    Ultimate: 500 + 100%

    Total: 890 + 185%

    Terra
    Force of Nature: 260 + 30% (x2) 520 + 60%
    Crushing Earth: 260 + 35% or (190 + 35%) x 2 = 380 + 75%
    Monolith: 200 + 50% (shatter) + 180 + 50%
    (Mind the passive, 10% extra on basic attacks, consider 3 = +30% or full + 90%)
    Note: it's unlikely that she'll get this full top damage unless someone can hold them on her monolith

    Total: 1280 + 235% / 315%

    Xing Tian
    Furious Roar: 210 + 60% + (2k health target) 240
    Hook Slam: 255 + 60%
    Sky-cutting Axe: 145 + 30% (x2) 290 + 60%
    Ultimate: 525 + 175%

    Total: 1520 + 355%

    Ymir
    Glacial Strike: 370 + 70%
    Frost Breath: 210 + 50%
    Ultimate: 1100 + 150%
    Frostbite (x2) = 68 X 4 + 20% X 4 = 272 + 80%
    Total: 1680 / 1952 + 270% / 350%
    Last edited by LuxInterior; 01-16-2018 at 02:24 PM.
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  2. #2
    Senior Member Prestigious LuxInterior's Avatar
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    Ranked by base damage:
    1. Ares: 2375
    2. Fafnir: 2150
    3. Ymir: 1680 | 1952 (with basics)
    4. Sobek: 1660
    5. Kuzenbo: 1640
    6. Athena: 1590 | 1850 (with basics)
    7. Ganesha: 1580
    8. Xing Tian: 1520
    9. Geb: 1470
    10. Cabrakan: 1466
    11. Khumbakarna: 1465
    12. Cerberus: 1321
    13. Terra: 1280
    14. Bacchus: 1120
    15. Artio: 1055
    16. Sylvanus: 890
    17. Khepri: 750


    Ranked by scaling:
    1. Fafnir: 494%
    2. Xing Tian: 355%
    3. Cabrakan: 330%
    4. Terra: 315%
    5. Athena: 300% | 420% (with basics)
    6. Ymir: 270% | 350% (with basics)
    7. Kuzenbo: 270%
    8. Cerberus: 261.5%
    9. Ganesha: 260%
    10. Ares: 216%
    11. Bacchus: 200%
    12. Sobek: 200%
    13. Artio: 195%
    14. Sylvanus: 185%
    15. Kumbhakarna: 175%
    16. Khepri: 120%
    17. Geb: 100%


    The first list shows how effective is penetration for each guardian. The second one, how power is.

    Of course, there are many details, like how easy it is to apply damage with each god, how many basics you can land, how Polynomicon and Soul Reaver can affect your burst, how unlikely it is to land a full Terra combo etc.

    Bacchus, for example, is a great infiltrator and finisher, despite being low in both base damage and scaling. Meanwhile, Athena takes forever to become effective as a damage dealer, from the need to level up the 2 first.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but Fafnir is the second most damaging mage in the game, losing only to Anubis.
    Last edited by LuxInterior; 01-16-2018 at 02:24 PM.
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    Senior Member Prestigious Charmander787's Avatar
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    So basically what your telling me is that Fafnir is the damage king? And that Ares really isnt all that damagy? yay for dragons!


    Nice analysis btw

    Would love to see one like this for every class


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    A Tragic Product of Swedish Advertising Demigod SirKeksalot's Avatar
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    Just wanna throw this out there--Shackles has an additional tic of initial damage every time Ares lands a chain. That results in a minimum of 5 tics, with 11 total tics if he hits a target 3 times.

    Quote Originally Posted by Charmander787 View Post
    And that Ares really isnt all that damagy?
    Ares is among the most damaging guardians around. Not only that, but his damage is DoT-based, meaning he can proc Magus for that dope-ass true damage.
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    The Mad Hatter Chosen Relanah's Avatar
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    This is entirely pointless.

    Since you just did on paper numbers without factoring in real world scenarios.

    Like, Athena's never gonna get 4x Reach procs, because you use 2+3 together to actually ensure the 3 hits.

    No-one's gonna get hit by Fafnir ult.

    Artio's bruiser power comes from her prot shred passive, which isn't calculated here (Also, you're better off AAing than using her Druid 3 for damage)

    You don't even go the full way when doing on paper numbers either, since you only calculated 2s of Cabrakan Tremors, when with Iso you can easily get 8-10 second Tremors provided you're not getting CC'd out of it. Which would put him as the "Most killingest" because it'd then be 1240 + 700% on top of the rest of hit kit for a total of 2390 + 870%

    But on paper numbers are again, worthless.

    You need to factor in things like what combos get used to actually SECURE damage?

    Like Ymir uses his stun to secure his carpet and his wall usually secures like 40-50% of his ult charge.

    Ganesh can leap to the top end of the list if he uses his dash to get someone stuck on his pillars threshold.

    Also as a side note, you're saying that Ares' flames when doing 24% of a 2000 health targets maximum health in damage is doing 240 damage (It's actually 480...)

    There's also something to be said about how these gods get built. Ares gets bonus 30 power per aura item he takes. Ares, Cabrakan and Bacchus can do well with Spear of the Magus to deal true damage to non-tanks. Etc.

    All should be factored in when truly wanting to discern the most potent bruiser guardian.
    Last edited by Relanah; 09-23-2017 at 11:50 AM.
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    A Tragic Product of Swedish Advertising Demigod SirKeksalot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Relanah View Post
    No-one's gonna get hit by Fafnir ult.
    If their escape is down and you land the stun, then immediately ult, then yeah, you can land it on one guy. If nothing else, your team can lock down some dudes for you.
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    The Mad Hatter Chosen Relanah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirKeksalot View Post
    If their escape is down and you land the stun, then immediately ult, then yeah, you can land it on one guy. If nothing else, your team can lock down some dudes for you.
    Though, if we're going down the "Your team can set up the god that's supposed to be at least in part setting up" route, then why not go whole hog and calculate how much damage Fafnir will deal when teamed up with full power + AS Chronos + Freya + Sol + Ao Kuang. 25% of their 1k power at 2.5 attacks a second would be 625 DPS per ally, meaning for the full 5s duration that's 3125 damage per ally for a total of 12500 damage.

    Most killingest god in the game!
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    Senior Member Prestigious LuxInterior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Relanah View Post
    Though, if we're going down the "Your team can set up the god that's supposed to be at least in part setting up" route, then why not go whole hog and calculate how much damage Fafnir will deal when teamed up with full power + AS Chronos + Freya + Sol + Ao Kuang. 25% of their 1k power at 2.5 attacks a second would be 625 DPS per ally, meaning for the full 5s duration that's 3125 damage per ally for a total of 12500 damage.

    Most killingest god in the game!
    The previous thread pointed to a lot of scenarios, considering basic attacks and combos, Bacchus' free power form ult etc. This time I'm simplifying things to prove a simple point: that guardians are far from equal and building them the same is a waste.

    Athena can actually land much more than 4 basics in her combo. What she won't normally do is landing the ultimate. But those maximum numbers are there just to show the potential. In other thread, I've shown that a dash + pull combo is comparable to Nox 3 + 1+ 2.

    Also, if you've never landed a Fafnir's ult, you aren't playing him right (or at all). The hammer pretty much guarantees it, sometimes on more than one god. People are also dumb and stay there not realizing how damaging the thing is. Finally, even without the ult, Fafnir is still the top damaging guardian.
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    A Tragic Product of Swedish Advertising Demigod SirKeksalot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Relanah View Post
    Though, if we're going down the "Your team can set up the god that's supposed to be at least in part setting up" route
    But I'm not. I said your team can set up Dragonic Corruption if nothing else after citing the fact that your stun usually confirms it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuxInterior View Post
    Also, if you've never landed a Fafnir's ult, you aren't playing him right (or at all). The hammer pretty much guarantees it, sometimes on more than one god. People are also dumb and stay there not realizing how damaging the thing is.
    All the people I play against, move out of it. I also tend to not use it so offensively right after my stun and instead use it to iframe out a ton of damage, because I value that more highly than the potential damage it might do IF I drop my stun on a dude point blank and ult.

    Finally, even without the ult, Fafnir is still the top damaging guardian.
    Unless you fully calculate Cabrakan's damage.
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