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Thread: Let's fix this God: Nu Wa!

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    Let's fix this God: Nu Wa!

    Ah, Nu Wa. We have been through some rough times. I remember the day when I looked at her old kit shortly after I started the game and was like: "This sounds strange and clunky and awkward, why would anyone want to play this? How is that even supposed to work? What is this passive, what, just....wha?"

    Then I got her in an Assault game and I had a blast with her. Everything about her was great and I had so many ideas of what cool things could be done with her and even though I never really was good with her, I thoroughly enjoyed my time with her.

    Then she got her rework because chinese people and conquest players are stupid and pretty much everything I liked about her got changed or taken away. I loved her old passive, it was great and interactive, so much fun to play around with. Her old voicepack was great. To this day, I sometimes push "VEG", hoping for her to say "Like a boss!", but we all know that she never will. And don't even get me started on her old ultimate....ah, the glorious days....


    These days, Nu Wa is that strange place where some people call her a support mage and others a burst mage, with the truth of the matter being that she is pretty terrible at doing both; meanwhile, HiRez insists that she is overall doing fine for herself to the point that they are pretty much afraid of buffing/changing her, thinking that it could be gamebreaking.

    With that being said, I dedicate this thread to one of my favorite Smite Girls and try to bring back some of Nu Was old flavor together with the mechanics of her new kit in a way that makes her exciting and novel to play without making her overpowered.


    Before we start:
    I will do things a bit different in this thread by not only talking about her current kit but also about her old kit. That won't make things less complicated, but much more interesting, so stay on your toes, boys and girls!

    There is a direction I want to take with Nu Wa here, so I will do an untypical thing and do a small TL;DR at the start so that you have a rough idea where I am heading with these changes:

    1. I want to bring back Nu Was old passive because it is the most fun and interactive passive we ever had in this game and because Snake Form Nu Wa needs to become a thing to see on a regular basis again.
    1.1 This of course means that the buffs have to return in some way.
    2. I do not intend to make Nu Wa a backdooring champion again in any way more or less than she is right now.
    3. I do intend to give her kit a pretty strong focus on zoning while trying to let her damage not become too bursty.
    4. I do intend to make her basic attacks relevant in someway to flow well with her kit, but again, not in a way that lets her become captain backdoor.
    5. I do intend to cut her current passive.
    6. No new Clay Soldier AI.


    The Abilities:
    Current Passive - Strength of Wood
    After 5 successful basic attacks, Nu Wa's next basic attack will root enemies.

    Root Duration: 1.5 seconds
    Old Passive - Elemental Crystals
    Nu Wa draws upon the power of the five-colored elemental crystals. When she uses an ability, it activates its corresponding crystal for 10s, granting her an additional bonus. When all crystals are active, Nu Wa transforms into her true snake form, refreshing the duration of all crystal bonuses for another 10s.

    Wood Crystal Bonus: 10 HP5. (Always Active)
    Nu Was new passive is one of the few passives in this game that has CC attached to it, which is inherently strong. Sadly, her current kit does not really promote/support using basic attacks at all aside from this passive and once you have 5 stacks, you have one shot, if you miss it, you gotta stack again.

    Her old passive is probably one of the most visually impressive passives because being turned into a snake lady was just that cool. Nu Wa to me back then gave me the same kind of goosebumbs when she turns like Fafnir does now. These days, she only transforms for a couple of seconds for her ultimate, which is a shame in and on itself.

    Gameplaywise, there was a lot of depth to her old passive and it had a lot of impact on her gameplay and did a great job at not only buffing herself but also her team. Probably the thing I miss most about old Nu Wa is this passive.

    The Problems with these:
    Sadly, her current kit does not really promote/support using basic attacks at all aside from this passive and once you have 5 stacks, you have one shot, if you miss it, you gotta stack again.

    Her old kit got reworked into the way it is now mostly because people disliked her backdoor potencial. Aside from the fact that said people were too stupid to ward and apparently are now cool with dealing with Skadi who is just as good if not better at backdooring, the numbers on the buffs she can give need a closer look since they apply to her entire closeby teammates.

    I would like to bring back Nu Was old passive again, including the snake form, but each individual buff will need a much closer look in order to not break her in any aspect while still keeping them interesting and worthwhile.

    I also would like the Wood-Buff to be scaling with her Maximum HP instead of being fixed HP5. Perhaps also some kind of mechanic/condition tied to it.


    Current 1. Ability - Mysterious Fog
    Nu Wa condenses moisture into fog at her location which then rolls forward away from her. She and all allies are stealthed while inside the fog, and have increased movement speed. Attacking breaks the stealth effect.
    Enemies that run into the fog take damage, and continue to take aditional damage again every second they are in the fog.
    Old 1. Ability - Fog
    Nu Wa condenses moisture into fog in a 20 ft radius at her location which follows her at 95% of her movement speed and lasts 10s. She and all allies are stealthed while inside the fog. Attacking breaks the stealth effect. Enemies caught inside the fog cloud are slowly choked for 10/20/30/40/50 (+10% of your magical power) damage every second. This ability also activates Nu Wa's Water Crystal, granting her an increased move speed aura.
    Both interesting abilities, but I actually like the new one much more than the old one. It is much more practicable to use offensivly for damaging purposes and zoning while the latter was much more "defensive" if you so want. The latter passive in return had the great water crystal aura for that massive speed aura for herself and her teammates to enjoy.

    The Probems with these:
    Honestly, there aren't too many "problems" I really see with either ability, aside from both of them not really fitting right in. Nu Was old 1 was mostly used for the stealth and the speedboost, her current 1 is mostly used as a follow up to her explosion combo and as a help for her wave clear.

    I would like to keep her current incarnation of this ability, but as I said, I want to bring back the old passive, so the water crystal needs to have an effect. Instead of increasing the movement speed as you stand within the fog, this aura will increase the movement speed of closeby allies (minions and claysoldiers included) by 15%. I also want to do something with the cooldown because I hate abilities that only give little benefits as you rank them up. 15/14/13/12/11 sounds fun. Maybe 16-12 instead.


    Current 2. Ability - Clay Soldiers
    Nu Wa conjures Clay Soldiers from the earth. These soldiers have health equal to 200 plus 20% of Nu Wa's maximum health, and deal damage with basic attacks. Enemies hit by their initial charge will take damage and have their magical protections reduced.
    Old 2. Ability - Clay Soldiers
    Nu Wa conjures up to 1/2/3/4/5 clay minions from the earth. These minions have health equal to 200 plus 20% of Nu Wa's maximum health and will push lanes and attempt to attack nearby structures, dealing 20 damage per hit. Minions last up to 10s or until they are slain. Using this ability also activates Nu Wa's Earth Crystal, granting her a physical protection aura.
    This ability made quite a jump in quality between the rekits. Less total claysoldiers, but they are all now more damaging and more mobile while also granting some protection shred.

    The Problems with these:
    Especially in a game where Hunters exist, utilizing these soldiers for anything but tanking towers can become quite bothersome, especially as a game progresses and since they are also tied to the regular minion AI, you can't just use them at any given opportunity you see fit. As I said, I also want to keep in the idea of her using abilities gives teamwide buffs, so there needs something to be done about that as well.

    I want to keep this ability in it's core as it is now, but I think that the Clay Soldiers should receive some of Nu Was protections to make them more durable, especially as the game progresses. Since they are also made out of earth, I think it would be a nice addition if lifestealing off of them would not be possible. Lastly, the protection granting Aura should be reintroduced. Old Nu Wa gave 10/15/20/25/30 Physical Protections, which sounds like a pretty fair deal overall to me.

    Current 3. Ability - Shining Metal
    Nu Wa launches a mass of shining metal, damaging all enemies it hits. If it hits one of her Clay Soldiers, it explodes, dealing additional damage and stunning enemies.
    Old 3. Ability - Flame Strike
    Nu Wa conjures an intense burst of flame in a 10 ft radius at her target location, dealing 60/100/140/180/220 (+60% of your magical power) damage, stunning enemies and enemy structures for 1s and igniting them for 5/10/15/20/25 (+10% of your magical power) additional damage every second for 2s. The damage increases the closer Nu Wa is to the source when cast, up to 1.5x at point blank range. This ability activates Nu Wa's Fire Crystal, granting her basic attacks splash damage that applies on-hit item effects.
    Nu Was 3. Ability and her Ultimate are arguably the active abilities that went through the most changes when she received her rekit. The current incarnation is fairly weak on its own but comes on a short cooldown, it's main purpose being that it is part of a combo paired with her most unreliable ability that, at the end of the day, still isn't all that exciting.

    Her old variant of this was very strong as a stand alone ability and got stronger as she closed in on her targets. It was also one of the only abilities in the game that did affect towers (correct me if I am wrong, but the only other ability should have been Chaacs Raindance and only because of a bug, enabling it to slow the ATK Speed of towers).

    The Problems with these:
    As I said, current Nude Was incarnation is weak as a standalone ability while being part of a very unreliable and unspectacular combo with her 2. My mainproblem with this ability though is that it feels like it is absolutly out of lore. Nu Wa is depicted as being a good girl, caring for her subjects. Her blowing up Clay Soldiers, which are basicly humans to my understanding, goes absolutly against all that she represents, at least to me.

    Her old form was old Nu Was only form of dealing damage regulary and was very strong at doing that, but the fact that it was usable on towers made her PVE game much better than it should have been, especially considering the whole lot of other PVE Advantages she had. As an extension, I also think that her heavy focus on PVE was always holding back some of her PVP potencial.

    So this ability will go through some drastic changes compaired to what it is now. Here is what I want to do with it.
    Crystal Fire Blast
    Nu Wa emits a strong fiery blast from her Crystal that deals damage 50/110/170/230/290 + 40% damage to all enemies surrounding her and knocks them back.

    Using this ability activates Nu Was Fire Crystal, granting Nu Wa and Clay Soldiers summoned by her 5/10/15/20/25 + 10% Magical Power as additional damage on their basic attacks. Empowered Clay Soldiers also take 3/6/9/12/15% less damage from enemy gods.

    Cooldown 13.
    Cost 80.
    A few pointers on this:

    As I said in the beginning, I intend to bring back Nu Was old ultimate and I really wanted to have at least one ability in her kit that comboes well with it. This ability having knock back is meant to serve as a way to either push enemies into the cage, forcing them to take damage and imprison them or pushing them out, basicly achieving the same.

    The Fire Crystal Passive is meant to do two things:

    1. It is supposed to give Synergy with her Clay Soldiers and increasing their performance (as do the other two abilities so far) while also giving back Nu Wa some of that old basic attack feeling without turning her into captain towerpush again, at least not too much. The extra damage proced by this is ability damage, so it won't affect towers, but it will apply Item on hit effects.

    Fuck Gem of Isolation with this though.


    Current Ultimate - Fire Shards
    Nu Wa flies up into the clouds, gaining visibility on all enemy gods, and summoning fire shards from the sky to damage each of them.
    Old Ultimate - Pillars of Heaven
    Nu Wa summons the pillars of heaven to imprison her enemies. Four metal pillars create a square with an electrical field in a 40 feet area. Enemies who pass through the field take 100/150/200/250/300 (+50% of your magical power) damage and are heavily slowed by 35/40/45/50/55% for 3s. This ability also activates Nu Wa's Metal Crystal, granting her basic attacks increased damage.
    Let us take a minute to recognize how huge the difference of old tooltips is compaired to more recent ones. I actually really miss these numbers standing in them. Because I'm a lazy scumbag, I won't edit in the values for the current stuff because it's tedious and because most people reading this already know about them and/or are smart enough, willing and able to read them up for themselves.

    Fire Shards is pretty straight forward. Damage every enemy god and show where they are.

    Pillars of Heaven has a lot more interesting applications going for it and I think that anyone who played her back then can attest how fun it was to use this ability in all kinds of different scenarios. One of my favorites being using this in Arena in a way that one of the central four pillars are standing right in the middle of the cage in a heated teamfight situation. Aaaah, the good old times.

    The Problems with these:
    Disagree with me, if you want, but most people hated Nu Was new ultimate. Aside from the fact that this ability unconditionally hitting everyone goes against this games philosophy of requiring skill to do things, it is unfun to play against, is unfun to use, the damage feels irrelevant most of the time and it is a huge waste of the potencially great snake form.

    Pillar of Heaven, to me, was a very exciting ability. It came on a short 60 second cooldown, which was pretty special back then, to me, it was Odins ultimate done right, which is fairly noteworthy as well, the damage and effects where very noticable, but not overpowered and the creativity in using this ability knew no ends. If anything, the extra 2x Basic attack damage together with Nu Was other factors made her towerpush too good overall.

    As I said, I want to go with Pillars of Heaven as her old and new ultimate here. The only things I intend to change are the following things:

    1. The Metal Shard Effect no longer doubles her basic attack damage, instead, it makes Nu Wa and her Clay Soldiers immune to slows for the duration. My reasoning for this is that I already gave Nu Wa a way to increase her basic attack damage with the fire crystal while I also wanted her snake form to actually feel like she turned into somekind of boss, and by that, I mean taking away some restrictions regular gods would have in regular situations.

    2. This ability used to deal the full damage everytime you passed through the field. We already had some flashbacks to Shake and Bake when Skadi was introduced to the game. The solution for this that the developers came up with was making it so that instead of taking the same amount of damage over and over for staying in the effect or trespassing again, you would take a smaller amount of damage instead. (look at Jing Weis 1 or Skadis 3 for comparison. Both lasting high damage AOE Effects that will only deal the brunt once and will deal smaller amounts for the rest of the duration instead. Nu Was 1 also does this).


    The Stats
    So I went an interesting design route with Nu Wa. She lost some damage potencial coming from her actual abilities but regained an actually useful yet strong ultimate in return. The scalings on her abilities are overall fairly low, but the damage dealt by herself and her more durable and mobile clay soldiers will cause some nice sustained damage.

    In regards of her base stats, there is still some work that needs to be done. Nu Was title is "Guardian of Heaven" and I would like her to follow suit and actually become a member of said class. Chinese gods have enough mages, so they will be okay with her abscence. In becoming a guardian, she will receive a boost to both her protections and her HP. The main reason as for why I want this is partly because she is now a mostly immobile goddess with no CC immunity, so that little bit of extra bulk will come in handy. These extra means of mitigation translating into her clay soldiers will also make them more capable in combat which is one of the main reasons why I would want these changes on top of what I did to the kit.

    The Strengths:
    This Version of Nu Wa excels at providing zoning tools and decent buffs to her teammates while also having noticable damage output. Between her Fog, her new 3 and the cage, she is able to control a battlefield and enemy movement within said battlefield in a way not being seen in this game for quite a while while also empowering herself and her minions to do the dirty work against the enemies that found themselves trespassing.

    The Counters:
    Nu Wa with this rekit will find herself being a somewhat immobile goddess that has to fight at a somewhat close range together with her minions. Enemy gods being able to quickly dispatch the clay soldiers will take care of a huge amount of Nu Was sustained damage potencial while very mobile gods will have a good time weaving in and out on her in ways that will make it hard for her to properly respond to. She also only has one source of hard CC, said CC being a knock back that is not intended to incapacitate long.

    The new and reworked Kit in summary:


    Passive - Elemental Crystals
    Nu Wa draws upon the power of the five-colored elemental crystals. When she uses an ability, it activates its corresponding crystal for 10s, granting her an additional bonus. When all crystals are active, Nu Wa transforms into her true snake form, refreshing the duration of all crystal bonuses for another 10s.

    Wood Crystal Bonus: 2% of her maximum health every 5 seconds as long as she stays in one place.
    1. Ability - Mysterious Fog
    Nu Wa condenses moisture into fog at her location which then rolls forward away from her. She and all allies are stealthed while inside the fog. Attacking breaks the stealth effect.
    Enemies that run into the fog take 50/75/100/125/150 (+50% of your magical power) damage, and continue to take aditional 10/20/30/40/50 (+10% of your magical power)damage again every second they are in the fog.

    This ability also activates Nu Wa's Water Crystal, granting her a 3/6/9/12/15% movement speed aura.

    Cooldown: 16/15/14/13/12 seconds
    2. Ability - Clay Soldiers
    Nu Wa conjures 1/2/2/2/3 Clay Soldiers from the earth. These soldiers have health equal to 200 plus 20% of Nu Wa's maximum health and 40% of her protections, and deal 20/30/40/50/60 damage with basic attacks. Enemies hit by their initial charge will take damage and have their magical protections reduced by 3/6/9/12/15.

    Using this ability also activates Nu Wa's Earth Crystal, granting her an aura that increases physical protections by 12/14/16/18/20.
    3. Ability Crystal Fire Blast
    Nu Wa emits a strong fiery blast from her Fire Crystal that deals 50/110/170/230/290 + 40% damage to all enemies surrounding her and knocks them back.

    Using this ability activates Nu Was Fire Crystal, granting Nu Wa and Clay Soldiers summoned by her 5/10/15/20/25 + 10% Magical Power as additional damage on their basic attacks. Empowered Clay Soldiers also take 3/6/9/12/15% less damage from enemy gods.

    Cooldown: 13 Seconds.
    Ultimate: Pillars of Heaven
    Nu Wa summons the pillars of heaven to imprison her enemies. Four metal pillars create a square with an electrical field in a 40 feet area. Enemies who pass through the field for the first time take 100/150/200/250/300 (+50% of your magical power) and 10/15/20/25/30 (+10% of your magical damage) damage for every following passing and are heavily slowed by 30/35/40/45/50% for 3s. This ability also activates Nu Wa's Metal Crystal, granting her and her clay soldiers immunity to slows.
    TL;DR Version and Summarization
    1. Nu Wa is now a guardian, fitting for her title, and received increased physical and magical protections as well as some extra base HP.
    2. She lost the combo to explode Clay Soldiers, instead, her kit emphazises buffing herself, allies and her clay soldiers to increase their damage and performance.
    3. Exchanged new ultimate with old ultimate, emphazises her strength on zoning in teamfights.
    4. Her 3 now deals splash damage around her and knocks back instead of being a line targeter.
    5. Old passive returns, functionality is the same, but some of the buffs are different.


    I hope that with these changes, I stayed true to my introduction.

    She will be remarkable at zoning thanks to controlling huge areas between her fog and her ultimate and can to an degree manipulate enemy movement with her 3 and her clay soldiers.
    Her damage coming from abilities will be relevant but not outstanding in both base damage and scaling. Excelling with her damagewise demands proper building to keep her Clay Soldiers alive, active, aggrod on the right targets and, of course, buffed.
    She will be using her basic attacks which will be strong thanks to her fire crystal, but her strong basic attacks won't be shredding towers more than any other mages. Neither will her clay soldiers although they will be more durable.

    What was important to me was that I really wanted to give her this "summoner" feeling that is and has been present before in both incarnations but was never really utilized well on her, or at all in this game so far. Current Nu Wa feels more like a Necromancer to me than a "Guardian of Heaven", honestly.

    This has been quite the post for me and it's a lot to take in, so take your time. Once you are done, feel free to leave a comment and tell me wether you liked it or not, if and what you think may be overpowered or underpowered or may simply not work. Or may be boring, I don't know.

    In regards to the numbers, I am not married to them, so if you have a strong feeling that some should be changed, tell me which ones and why and we will have a discussion about that.
    Last edited by PapaRodin; 07-10-2016 at 11:27 AM.
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    Banned Prestigious TheoHel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PapaRodin View Post
    As I said, current Nude Was incarnation is weak as a standalone ability
    Even autocorrect wants some great Nu Wa n00dz.

    On a serious matter, they could either go with your suggestion or just

    BLOODY.FIX.THE.CLAY.SOLDIER.AI!!

    And please, for the love of all that's Karthus-ish, don't remove her current ultimate, maybe, just maybe, give a tiny buff to its early damage. Come on, it's the only ultimate of its kind and it kind of needs to exist.

    And in case you wonder, yes, I did read this thread mainly because I have nothing better to do with my life.
    Last edited by TheoHel; 07-10-2016 at 11:37 AM.

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    Senior Member Infamous PapaRodin's Avatar
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    I actually call her Nude Wa all the time, intentionally. No auto correct needed for that.

    Why do you say that her ultimate in it's current form needs to exist? Because honestly, if anything, I find that her ultimate in its current forms is one of the most redundant ones we have in the game. It is also not the first global all enemy god affecting ultimate in the game, so it also isn't one of a kind either.
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    Banned Prestigious TheoHel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PapaRodin View Post
    I actually call her Nude Wa all the time, intentionally. No auto correct needed for that.

    Why do you say that her ultimate in it's current form needs to exist? Because honestly, if anything, I find that her ultimate in its current forms is one of the most redundant ones we have in the game. It is also not the first global all enemy god affecting ultimate in the game, so it also isn't one of a kind either.
    Oh I see. Don't worry, we can all dream.

    The reason why you find her ultimate so redundant is because its damage is equal with dog crap unless you get fed. It may not be the first, but currently (if I remember right), it is the only ability that damages the enemy team no matter what (unless Sanctuary). The closest thing we've got that comes close is Neith's ulti but it can be blocked and it affects just one person.
    Last edited by TheoHel; 07-10-2016 at 11:47 AM.

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    Xbalanque exists.

    And even if Xbalanque wouldn't be a thing, there is no Iron Rule that there HAS to be an ability that affects the entire enemy team in some way or form.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PapaRodin View Post
    Xbalanque exists.
    His ult doesn't deal damage, but fair enough.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PapaRodin View Post

    Then she got her rework because chinese people and conquest players are stupid and pretty much everything I liked about her got changed or taken away.
    The part about Chinese people and conquest players being stupid is also intentional?
    元.夕..口.占

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    Senior Member Infamous PapaRodin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mouhappai View Post
    The part about Chinese people and conquest players being stupid is also intentional?
    Absolutly.

    Aside from me saying stupid to literally everyone and everything at every given occassion, myself included, it is no secret that

    1. Tencent was like "Yo, HiRez. Our people can't really recognize that Nu Wa is Nu Wa, can you do something about that?" I am no pro on chinese lore myself, but all traditional depictions of Nu Wa I have seen pretty much shown her being bare naked. Of course, we could not have that in the game, so now she has nothing but some cloth hiding her lady bits. Which is cool and dandy, I like half naked goddesses as much as the next man, but they heavily reduced the entire snake aspect on her kit compaired to before, which, honestly, I have a hard time believing that this helped people recognize that Nu Wa is supposed the Snake Goddess Guardian of Heaven instead of some pocahontas rip off that got lost on her way to the next local strip club.

    Not that I expect anyone or anything to be smart and reasonable when it comes to mythology and religion, but let us put that to the side: The main point here is: This is stupid and does not make a lot of sense aside from wanting to get Nu Wa out of her clothes.

    Which, in retrospect, actually does make sense.

    2. Players are fucking stupid. MagicFighter can come and provide his fancy twitch link that shows some stupid at the time popular smite streamer and his equally stupid team having 2, almost 3 phonixes backdoored by the goddess who was, at the time, infamous and known for being able to do that.

    You will also see, in that very same video, that nobody cared about properly warding the place or remotely trying to keep track of her movements and whereabouts.

    The problems are pretty open here. "Warding", "Awareness", "Knowledge", these things you can't expect from the casual joker who queues for conquest. What you can expect said stupids to do is that they will complain. A lot, with endurance and loooooud.

    And HiRez listened. Not that I am particulary un-okay with them wanting to take away some of Nu Was backdoor potencial, I did the same in this post, but the way they did it, buy cutting away everything that made old Nu Wa great, that was beyond stupid.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PapaRodin View Post

    1. Tencent was like "Yo, HiRez. Our people can't really recognize that Nu Wa is Nu Wa, can you do something about that?" I am no pro on chinese lore myself, but all traditional depictions of Nu Wa I have seen pretty much shown her being bare naked. Of course, we could not have that in the game, so now she has nothing but some cloth hiding her lady bits. Which is cool and dandy, I like half naked goddesses as much as the next man, but they heavily reduced the entire snake aspect on her kit compaired to before, which, honestly, I have a hard time believing that this helped people recognize that Nu Wa is supposed the Snake Goddess Guardian of Heaven instead of some pocahontas rip off that got lost on her way to the next local strip club.
    That reminds me...


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    The Kali controversy was on an entirely different level of stupid and we still feel the aftereffects of that happening even today.

    Honestly, I personally don't care how naked or not the goddesses in this game are or are not. I want them to be good and playable while also being at least somewhat true to their origin story while also having interesting ingame personalities and good voicepacks.
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