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Thread: The Community and the Issue of Balance

  1. #21
    Senior Member Prestigious HawkboyJr's Avatar
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    Is it really an insult, though, to say that the average casual player is probably going to be worse than the average pro player? It shouldn't be, it should really just be a case of stating the obvious. That's not to say that SPL players can't be talking out of their asses, or that non-SPL players can't have a firmer grip than even the best of the SPL, it's just that their ability is, at least to some degree proven by the simple fact that they have had consistent success at the SPL level, while the average casual player's has not, so by virtue of their greater credentials the professional player is left with a lighter burden of proof, which seems perfectly normal, regardless of field of discussion.

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    Senior Member Chosen Skode's Avatar
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    The issue is Smite is F2P. Hirez have to balance not just for pro play but casual too, made worse by balancing for one mode can offbalance another. I dont envy them, they get hate when they nerf and hate when they buff and by biased viewpoints as we ALL are biased on certain aspects.

  3. #23
    Senior Member Chosen Drago55577's Avatar
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    Personally I think balancing around the casual crowd in most cases is just a bad idea. It's the players that can use things to their strengths that make or break the game, in casuals, people just play. But it's the good players that can show how a god is truly overpowered, and that's where balancing should be focused.

    The only reason I could say it could be acceptable, is because the god is not just over-performing in casuals, it's completely and utterly dominating everything, even when a casual player uses it. Look at Raijin, sure people say he's balanced overall, but he can quite literally oneshot you at level 12~ with his 2-1 combo when you're just as ahead as he is.

    But mostly, the game should be balanced around higher skill levels. As I said above, casual players don't know what they're doing and just press buttons. If you balance around that, the casual players will still do what they do best, press buttons and play the game.

    Quote Originally Posted by DeeickMith View Post
    I didn't know opinions could be wrong.
    In cases such as this, it's not your opinion your putting forth if you join a discussion. You are stating a fact, and it is up to you to try and prove that fact, while others either back you up or attempt to disprove it. You can't just go and say "I think Kukulkan is OP", then refuse to argue it because it's your opinion. You are trying to state a fact, not an opinion.

    It's like trying to say the sky is mostly green, there is no argument here and it's just not. It's not your opinion. EDIT: Now that I say this, I feel it would be better to say that yes, this is your opinion, but your opinion is outright fucking wrong.

    On the topic of opinions though, Satori is best waifu.

    Quote Originally Posted by HawkboyJr View Post
    Is it really an insult, though, to say that the average casual player is probably going to be worse than the average pro player? It shouldn't be, it should really just be a case of stating the obvious. That's not to say that SPL players can't be talking out of their asses, or that non-SPL players can't have a firmer grip than even the best of the SPL, it's just that their ability is, at least to some degree proven by the simple fact that they have had consistent success at the SPL level, while the average casual player's has not, so by virtue of their greater credentials the professional player is left with a lighter burden of proof, which seems perfectly normal, regardless of field of discussion.
    I agree. It's a terrible notion that calling a casual player worse than a competitive/professional player is some sort of insult. If the casual player was that good, they would more than likely find themselves not being seen as a casual player by most people. Aside from that, professional players can be shit, they just get paid to be shit.

    In my own experiences, I get called a tryhard and all manner of nasty things (The best are when people tell me to kill myself, good laugh.), because I play Smite quite often and tend to win. I'd play ranked if that existed in Australia, but oh well.
    Last edited by Drago55577; 03-29-2016 at 02:46 AM.
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    Senior Member Chosen Skode's Avatar
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    Yet how to judge skill levels of "feedback", theres danger of eletism if we take heed of only feedback from a skill tier of players esp if it ruins a new players experience of the game, Hirez needs an inclusive to all crowds game to make money and thrive.

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    Senior Member Chosen Drago55577's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skode View Post
    Yet how to judge skill levels of "feedback", theres danger of eletism if we take heed of only feedback from a skill tier of players esp if it ruins a new players experience of the game, Hirez needs an inclusive to all crowds game to make money and thrive.
    How do you balance around both skilled players and casual players, though? They're two completely different audiences that want completely different things, the difference being, one audience understands how the game works, the other doesn't.
    Aim high. One day I will be HirezPonPon, I will wear his skin. Or you know, just be a moderator.
    A pretty amazing skin idea, SAW Scylla. Quite literally the best MOTD, Mayhem
    My Nox Rework, Anubis Rework, Nu Wa Orbital Terror, Hell Ymir Satori Komeiji is my waifu.
    When can we put gifs in our signature? http://puu.sh/jNNd9.gif
    Mode idea thread!

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    Senior Member Honoured MadManToTheMax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HawkboyJr View Post
    Is it really an insult, though, to say that the average casual player is probably going to be worse than the average pro player? It shouldn't be, it should really just be a case of stating the obvious. That's not to say that SPL players can't be talking out of their asses, or that non-SPL players can't have a firmer grip than even the best of the SPL, it's just that their ability is, at least to some degree proven by the simple fact that they have had consistent success at the SPL level, while the average casual player's has not, so by virtue of their greater credentials the professional player is left with a lighter burden of proof, which seems perfectly normal, regardless of field of discussion.
    Oh no mechanically I suck. I'm just a floundering fish hitting buttons. What I mean is when people come on to the forums asking for opinions, and then say those opinions are wrong because it's not what the pros say. Why do they bother posting if they're just going to refute what people say? That's what bothers me. I don't want to type out a response if the person is just going to act like I'm talking out of my ass and am just a follower sheep.

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    Senior Member Chosen Drago55577's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadManToTheMax View Post
    Oh no mechanically I suck. I'm just a floundering fish hitting buttons. What I mean is when people come on to the forums asking for opinions, and then say those opinions are wrong because it's not what the pros say. Why do they bother posting if they're just going to refute what people say? That's what bothers me. I don't want to type out a response if the person is just going to act like I'm talking out of my ass and am just a follower sheep.
    Because that's the point of a discussion. You refute and/or discuss their point, but "The pros didn't say that" is not a valid point of discussion.

    People need to refute things properly, rather than essentially just saying "You're shit lol"
    Aim high. One day I will be HirezPonPon, I will wear his skin. Or you know, just be a moderator.
    A pretty amazing skin idea, SAW Scylla. Quite literally the best MOTD, Mayhem
    My Nox Rework, Anubis Rework, Nu Wa Orbital Terror, Hell Ymir Satori Komeiji is my waifu.
    When can we put gifs in our signature? http://puu.sh/jNNd9.gif
    Mode idea thread!

  8. #28
    Senior Member Honoured MadManToTheMax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drago55577 View Post
    How do you balance around both skilled players and casual players, though? They're two completely different audiences that want completely different things, the difference being, one audience understands how the game works, the other doesn't.
    I wouldn't go as far as casuals don't understand how the game works period. I think it's that the casual crowd has a larger diversity of opinion on balance.

  9. #29
    Senior Member Honoured MadManToTheMax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drago55577 View Post
    Because that's the point of a discussion. You refute and/or discuss their point, but "The pros didn't say that" is not a valid point of discussion.

    People need to refute things properly, rather than essentially just saying "You're shit lol"
    I'm fine with a good argument. It's the "You're shit lol" comeback that pisses me off. It's not constructive whatsoever.

  10. #30
    Senior Member Chosen Drago55577's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadManToTheMax View Post
    I'm fine with a good argument. It's the "You're shit lol" comeback that pisses me off. It's not constructive whatsoever.
    Tell me about it.
    Aim high. One day I will be HirezPonPon, I will wear his skin. Or you know, just be a moderator.
    A pretty amazing skin idea, SAW Scylla. Quite literally the best MOTD, Mayhem
    My Nox Rework, Anubis Rework, Nu Wa Orbital Terror, Hell Ymir Satori Komeiji is my waifu.
    When can we put gifs in our signature? http://puu.sh/jNNd9.gif
    Mode idea thread!

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