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Thread: The Community and the Issue of Balance

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    Otaku Mod Infamous MiyobiKumagawa's Avatar
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    The Community and the Issue of Balance

    Overview
    In truth I wanted to get this discussion going because most of you don't realize how much of an impact you make in this game whether in the game or outside of it in the Forums, Reddit, Twitter, Twitch, and Youtube. Now first I'll present some issues that we are facing in regards of how the community can affect how characters performs in a game whether or not on the competitive side or casual crowd.

    Jim Sterling


    Extra Credit



    Links for more
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e31OSVZF77w
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ai6oMY4U0Yw
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2RYtGfTrV0

    My Opinion
    In honesty the community doesn't seem to realize how Hi Rez attempts to cater both sides which in essence can be good because there is no set roles regarding classes. Guardians can play solo lane along with Hunters, Mages, Warriors, and Assassins. Hunters, depending on the God could play mid lane as efficiently as a Mage during even competitive e-sports. While game balance teams like Riot cater to their meta and nerf Gods based on the overall performances outside the intended lane.

    At the same time can be bad since you have two crowds you are attempting to please between the casuals and the hardcore competitive crowd.

    So how does the community determine balance? First off are the overall statistics of how Gods perform in the season. Example would be Hercules who had an average of 50% back during S1 and S2. Once S3 hit then Hercules unfortunately got shafted down to a staggering 47% percent on average.

    How is that possible? Well first is the overall community completely split on the matter. The casual crowd that can either do on average performance on average games or completely suck when against an opponent with a higher skill ratio. While in high competitive play, Herc can be overall strong or be countered hard depending on built items and team comps.

    The two ratios usually end up conflicting one another.

    I'm both casual and competitive. I love playing Smite, but at the same time I play to win so I play all the Gods excessively so I know their strengths and weaknesses to debate with the community. What I can't stand however are those in the casual crowds that don't listen to anyone and demand to have an I-Win button because they are not skilled enough to commit towards new mechanics and changes to the meta.

    Pros sadly enough are a lot more unified regarding balance discussions. While they are completely biased regarding their choices of Gods. They provide constructive criticism when it comes to their feedback. They don't use other player's profile to fuel their egos to measure how big they can stroke, but to how they can counter each other's arguments in a detailed manner.

    The community can do that as well, but there are those here that don't realize how much of an impact they make regarding balance.

    Another good example is Skadi. Community equally split regarding how balanced she is. I on the fence feel that she is balanced. Does she need tweaking? Yes, but nothing huge to call out, "OMFG SHE NEEDS A NERF SO PEOPLE THAT DON"T AGREE WITH ME ARE PIECES OF SHELT!!!!" or "STFU YOUR PLAYER PROFILE SAYS YOU BUILD LIKE SLFT! LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOOLOLOLOLOOLOLOLOLOLOOLOLOL OLOLOLOLOOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOOLOLOLOL!!!!!"

    In honesty I feel it's the refusal to cope with new mechanics and the fact those in the community are angry because they got outplayed and kept attempting to box her in 1 v 1 scenarios.

    As a moderator I've seen pointless arguments like these that gets threads closed. In honesty I feel a good amount have too much pride in their own opinions and don't actively engage to counter argue using valid data and actual algebra. It's to the point where those in the community would forge data to get their own stand in the argument while ignoring everyone else.
    *Disclaimer: I am a volunteer moderator. I work on best judgement and do not speak on behalf of Hi-Rez Studios.*


  2. #2
    Senior Member Chosen ShoNuff Kay's Avatar
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    The only problem I have with god balance discussion on the forums is people refusal to discuss or civilly debate. Instead it turns into "Let me pull your SGS and use it as an argument." Or the infamous "That god must be your main so you don't want them nerfed"
    Mastery X Ravana

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    Yeah I know What the tier lists and pros say.

    Too bad I don't care.

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    I'm coming for you Rama

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    Not having mobility is better anyways because it means you have 4 skills designed to kick the ass of your opponents.

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    Otaku Mod Infamous MiyobiKumagawa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShoNuff Kay View Post
    The only problem I have with god balance discussion on the forums is people refusal to discuss or civilly debate. Instead it turns into "Let me pull your SGS and use it as an argument." Or the infamous "That god must be your main so you don't want them nerfed"
    Civil debates are almost impossible in a forum due to a single factor of refusal of being wrong. People hate being wrong and will pull out multiple attempts to dissuade that they are wrong even if information was presented in orderly manner.
    *Disclaimer: I am a volunteer moderator. I work on best judgement and do not speak on behalf of Hi-Rez Studios.*


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    Lord of the Enigs Infamous Enigmatisty's Avatar
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    I think Hi-Rez just needs to regard balance with an iron fist and be adamant towards everyone with whom they take their opinions on a certain aspect of the game from, pro and casual alike. I understand the bullshit that happens on here, but that doesn't mean you can just disregard it and search for the gems of information that pop up.
    Actually back to Smite but my love for the forums isn't really the same anymore. May most likely not post god concepts again.

    Since forums are dying, feel free to join the official smite forum discord where most retired members chill.

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    Trash Doggo Demigod Goobis's Avatar
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    I use every source I can get be it Pro League, Casual Data, and General Preformance. If someone wants to be a jackass and comment things like SPL doesn't matter or balance should be X only well I just ignore them in the discussion.

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    Otaku Mod Infamous MiyobiKumagawa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MagicFighter View Post
    I use every source I can get be it Pro League, Casual Data, and General Preformance. If someone wants to be a jackass and comment things like SPL doesn't matter or balance should be X only well I just ignore them in the discussion.
    Statistics are one thing, but even that can't be used as the overall factor to win all arguments. Remember the Talon incident where it was proven that algebraic wise in stats and gold that other items fare better than Talon itself.

    Even if it wasn't built during pro leagues many times, it still was a staple item built 7/10 in all levels of play. So statistics wise by your logic, Talon is a more optimal choice regardless of what data was used in a proven mathematical comparison.

    Statistics are only partial of any argument, but a good amount of balancing can be done utilizing hypothesis, common sense, and equations in overall balance.
    *Disclaimer: I am a volunteer moderator. I work on best judgement and do not speak on behalf of Hi-Rez Studios.*


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    Senior Member Prestigious Fênrîr's Avatar
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    My problem with a lot of these balance threads is the following;

    Forum poster A creates a thread complaining about X being OP.

    Forum poster B starts a debate.

    Forum posters C,D E and F attempt to contribute.

    5 pages later we find out Forum poster A is an Arena player, Forum poster B primarily plays 1v1 and C, D, E and F are a mixture of siege and conquest.

    People really need to specify what gamemode they are referring to because it would help to avoid some of the dumbest crap that is posted on these forums.

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    Senior Member Infamous TheLethalCorgi's Avatar
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    My problem is that people judge a gods potential on their own play.

  9. #9
    Otaku Mod Infamous MiyobiKumagawa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fênrîr View Post
    My problem with a lot of these balance threads is the following;

    Forum poster A creates a thread complaining about X being OP.

    Forum poster B starts a debate.

    Forum posters C,D E and F attempt to contribute.

    5 pages later we find out Forum poster A is an Arena player, Forum poster B primarily plays 1v1 and C, D, E and F are a mixture of siege and conquest.

    People really need to specify what gamemode they are referring to because it would help to avoid some of the dumbest crap that is posted on these forums.
    Don't forget poster G, the sideline commenter that just posts in agreement with poster A with little to no self-thought.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheLethalCorgi View Post
    My problem is that people judge a gods potential on their own play.
    I've seen enough of this that I've gotten sick of it. Especially when it comes to Gods like Odin and Geb when they were given their own threads and all matter of opinions and facts were ignored because "my experience" equals "community voice and everyone else is wrong".
    *Disclaimer: I am a volunteer moderator. I work on best judgement and do not speak on behalf of Hi-Rez Studios.*


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    Banned Infamous Macaulyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLethalCorgi View Post
    My problem is that people judge a gods potential on their own play.
    Its made even worse when people are losing to said god instead, specially when its a new god.

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