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View Full Version : What do you think of a new physical item which contains attack speed and crit chance.



AlexNemesis
10-06-2015, 11:52 AM
Our crit chance items just got power and crit chance, wouldn't be nice one item for attack speed and crit chance? I know hunters like Xbla gonna shit on people, so I am just asking :D All other MOBA got some items like that :eek:

What do you say?

IrishPotato
10-06-2015, 11:53 AM
Moved appropriately

HawkboyJr
10-06-2015, 12:07 PM
You mean Golden Bow? Yeah, it sucks.

IrishPotato
10-06-2015, 12:13 PM
You mean Golden Bow? Yeah, it sucks.

Doesn't give attack speed.

AlexNemesis
10-06-2015, 12:35 PM
You mean Golden Bow? Yeah, it sucks.

yeah, a little MS, It is not so good, unless in assault and arena, specially on Merc but conq I won't waste one space on it.

HawkboyJr
10-06-2015, 01:07 PM
Doesn't give attack speed.
*checks*
Huh, what'd y'know. My bad. ^_^
Maybe give it some attack speed?

AlexError
10-06-2015, 06:30 PM
You mean add more diversity to the relatively stale itemisation we've got? Sure!

I think you'd have to give it a unique passive to make it an interesting item

IFlip92
10-06-2015, 08:36 PM
You mean add more diversity to the relatively stale itemisation we've got? Sure!

I think you'd have to give it a unique passive to make it an interesting item

I agree with the staleness of the itemization. We should see a lot more counter parts between Physical and Magical items and there's currently so many poor items in the game that I wouldn't waste an item slot for regardless of the God Eg. Dynasty Helm. Who the hell builds that?

The only Gods that I find have decent itemization options are the Supports oddly enough. Anyone else is rather locked into the same items with slight variations.

RainbowSplat
10-07-2015, 01:59 AM
since crits are OP the least thing i want is new crit items

KAKLAW
10-07-2015, 02:45 AM
since crits are OP the least thing i want is new crit items

Crits aren't OP.

Limited itemization against them and protections sufficient enough to deal with crits being feasilbly built on two roles at best is.

RippleApple
10-07-2015, 09:19 AM
Rage used to give attack speed. It got nerfed a long time ago. But honestly I think that a crit item that gives attack speed isn't a bad idea as long as the crit and attack speed are modest. It's just, rage shouldn't be in the game at all. I'd rather have more interesting choices for crit items since rage is such a good item on basic attackers to the point that there's almost no reason not to buy it on them. There's no reason for crit to be chance-based with an item that increases the chance just by using it. Getting rid of rage and replacing it with a few new choices would be the best way to keep crit strong while making it make more sense overall.

Here's some examples:
A rage-like crit item that increases crit chance when you use abilities by 20% per ability used, refreshed when you hit a basic. Basically a hun batz passive in item form.

A bancrofts-like crit item that increases crit damage based on your current HP.

Or the opposite of that, increasing crit damage at higher levels of health but lowering it when you take damage. Like that shield item, but without the defensive buff.

A crit item that reduces enemy crit chance or enemy crit damage.

A crit item that gives pen, just get rid of The Crusher in exchange since nobody likes it.

One that causes you to always crit but reduces the crit damage modifier significantly, for attack speed builds.

Or a stacking crit item of some sort.

AlexError
10-07-2015, 09:22 AM
Rage used to give attack speed. It got nerfed a long time ago. But honestly I think that a crit item that gives attack speed isn't a bad idea as long as the crit and attack speed are modest. It's just, rage shouldn't be in the game at all. I'd rather have more interesting choices for crit items since rage is such a good item on basic attackers to the point that there's almost no reason not to buy it on them. There's no reason for crit to be chance-based with an item that increases the chance just by using it. Getting rid of rage and replacing it with a few new choices would be the best way to keep crit strong while making it make more sense overall.

Rage adds reliability to crits, so hunters are actually relevant with a crit build. In my opinion, its the fact that every physical god starts off with +100% crit damage automatically and Deatbringer which are the issues.

Jezereal
10-07-2015, 09:31 AM
Rage adds reliability to crits, so hunters are actually relevant with a crit build. In my opinion, its the fact that every physical god starts off with +100% crit damage automatically and Deatbringer which are the issues.
Dat vertigo avatar though. DAAAAAAAM. Those days of funorb.

RippleApple
10-07-2015, 09:31 AM
Rage adds reliability to crits, so hunters are actually relevant with a crit build. In my opinion, its the fact that every physical god starts off with +100% crit damage automatically and Deatbringer which are the issues.

Deathbringer by itself isn't a problem, though, and malice isn't a very good item in and of itself. A 20% chance to do 140% more damage isn't really that much at all. When you add rage into the mix, that's a 50% chance that increases by 10% every time it doesn't crit. That's way too high a chance for such a high payoff.

One time I didn't crit four times in a row with that setup. Because I was unlucky, I was unable to box my opponent, so I died, whereas they crit four times in a row with the same setup. That's how crit should work, and yet that's literally only happened once to me so far in over 1000 games played. It's because rage is too good of an item, not deathbringer.

Maybe if you could only buy one crit item from that tree it would be more balanced.

AlexNemesis
10-07-2015, 04:13 PM
Well, I really hope we get that combo in an item, Crits are there to keep the game balanced in my idea. Or Tank meta which is the worst and boring meta can destroy the fun, just like LOL now or strong guardians released and buffed in smite.

KingScuba
10-07-2015, 06:14 PM
if an item was made with attack speed along with crit it would probably become a core item... so nty.

IFlip92
10-07-2015, 10:37 PM
Crits aren't OP.

Limited itemization against them and protections sufficient enough to deal with crits being feasilbly built on two roles at best is.

That's probably the worst idea ever. If there would be a protection item that could deal with crits then everybody would build it because it would make any other forms of damage a complete breeze. If you mean something which targets Crits specifically there is such an item and it's called Celestial Helm but it still needs some work. I think the refresh should be once every 3 seconds which would force a Hunter to counterbuild that with more AS. Remove that +40 MP for 3 secs crap from it too.

I find Warrior hybrid builds impossible to defeat when boxing anyway since they almost all have gap closers or CC to close the gap on you. Take Chaac or Herc for example. By the time you shred through their healing as a Hunter or Assassin you are probably dead. Hell, a properly built Ymir and some Guardians can also outbox an Assassin/Hunter, key word here being EVENTUALLY. Simply a game of who can outlast the other.

MaverickSlayer
10-10-2015, 07:19 PM
Maybe if you could only buy one crit item from that tree it would be more balanced.
This, if you have rage and malice or Death Bringer you are virtually guaranteed to crit multiple times in a row within one battle. The problem with crits is that the RNG is too generous, because you can just stack crit chance so that you crit 75% of the time. Hell, I even see people with all 3 main crit items from time to time, and when they do they literally always kill hunters, assassins and mages who are building damage in 2 basic attacks. If you were limited to one item in the tree it would be more balanced, because it would actually be RNG and not "Buy these two items to hit for 700 on your basic attacks almost every time!"

KAKLAW
10-30-2015, 12:27 AM
That's probably the worst idea ever. If there would be a protection item that could deal with crits then everybody would build it because it would make any other forms of damage a complete breeze. If you mean something which targets Crits specifically there is such an item and it's called Celestial Helm but it still needs some work. I think the refresh should be once every 3 seconds which would force a Hunter to counterbuild that with more AS. Remove that +40 MP for 3 secs crap from it too.

I find Warrior hybrid builds impossible to defeat when boxing anyway since they almost all have gap closers or CC to close the gap on you. Take Chaac or Herc for example. By the time you shred through their healing as a Hunter or Assassin you are probably dead. Hell, a properly built Ymir and some Guardians can also outbox an Assassin/Hunter, key word here being EVENTUALLY. Simply a game of who can outlast the other.

Until non crit builds become viable then crit will remain a balancing issue because to counter crit with good items those items also spill into other niches like how MM can do so much everything with it's massive price.

Rokusho66
11-03-2015, 07:31 AM
my thoughts on this....
http://s.quickmeme.com/img/04/042d13941d496e48f98e161f8c9663d492f742eca42432e53b cf6ddd0f282108.jpg

MaverickSlayer
11-11-2015, 08:36 PM
Crits aren't OP.

Limited itemization against them and protections sufficient enough to deal with crits being feasilbly built on two roles at best is.
Yes, they are. If you get power instead of crits as a hunter your performance will never be as good as if you built crits. A little more ability damage can't be compared to 250% damage on almost every basic you shoot out when you get rage and deathbringer. The issue with crits I have is that the rng is much too generous. Rage should only give 25% and 5% per stack and it would be much more balanced. All other crit items are much more powerful in combination with rage.

crippler38
11-17-2015, 09:55 AM
That's probably the worst idea ever. If there would be a protection item that could deal with crits then everybody would build it because it would make any other forms of damage a complete breeze. If you mean something which targets Crits specifically there is such an item and it's called Celestial Helm but it still needs some work. I think the refresh should be once every 3 seconds which would force a Hunter to counterbuild that with more AS. Remove that +40 MP for 3 secs crap from it too.

I find Warrior hybrid builds impossible to defeat when boxing anyway since they almost all have gap closers or CC to close the gap on you. Take Chaac or Herc for example. By the time you shred through their healing as a Hunter or Assassin you are probably dead. Hell, a properly built Ymir and some Guardians can also outbox an Assassin/Hunter, key word here being EVENTUALLY. Simply a game of who can outlast the other.

unless you're hou yi with titan's bane and ignore 58% of someone's armor (hou yi's 2 makes hou yi ignore armor just like titans bane so they stack)

so nyehehe (*cries in a corner from the pain of hou yi vs tanks)

MaverickSlayer
11-20-2015, 11:43 PM
unless you're hou yi with titan's bane and ignore 58% of someone's armor (hou yi's 2 makes hou yi ignore armor just like titans bane so they stack)

so nyehehe (*cries in a corner from the pain of hou yi vs tanks)
Hou Yi's 2 only gives 25% at level 5 though, so that's 55% only at max level.

LoudAndAnnoying
11-21-2015, 08:58 AM
Hou Yi's 2 only gives 25% at level 2 though, so that's 55% only at max level.

And? You just max that first if you want to kill tanks.

MaverickSlayer
11-21-2015, 10:33 PM
And? You just max that first if you want to kill tanks.
Putting 4 extra points into that just for some penetration against one member of their team doesn't seem like a smart tactic, but that's me.

shikakrux
11-22-2015, 03:13 PM
i think critical should be removed from the game or it should at least be much more expensive because lets be honest: sometimes i got critted for over one thousand damage.

KAKLAW
12-16-2015, 12:35 AM
Crit should be nerfed to be on par with Qin's based builds.

Like it makes every other build worthless at this point since the risk of RNG is pretty much zero with triple crit CONSISTANCY IS WORTHELSS ON A NON CRIT BUILD WHEN TRIPLE CRIT IS SUPER CONSISTANT. 50% is still 100%!! and 70%+ even moreso. the fact that IT SCALES WITH LIFESTEAL IS EVEN MORE ABSURD since even with gods that have stuff in their kit to make Qin's builds workable like Chiron, Hou yi, Rama, Apollo, etc the crit lifesteal is too much to give up.

KatHead
12-20-2015, 05:24 PM
Rage should be reworked into a different item.

Rage

Cost: 2850

30% Attack Speed
30% Critical Strike
+5% Move Speed

Passive: Minions and Jungle monsters may no longer block your path.

RippleApple
12-20-2015, 05:37 PM
I still think crit items should be one per build...

KAKLAW
12-27-2015, 11:26 PM
I still think crit items should be one per build...

I think crits should be max trip crit 60% or the crit % cap is 60%.
Lifesteal does not scale with crit if you crit for 400 you still lifesteal for the non crit hit value.
Rage is too good, nerf the passive or nerf the power.

KAKLAW
12-27-2015, 11:27 PM
I still think crit items should be one per build...

I think crits should be max trip crit 60% or the crit % cap is 60%.
Lifesteal does not scale with crit if you crit for 400 you still lifesteal for the non crit hit value.
Rage is too good, nerf the passive or nerf the power.

re1wind
12-30-2015, 08:14 PM
Criticals and the itemization thereof have always been a bit of a...battlefield.

The main alternative to crit builds was quinn's sais + attack speed, but that got nerfed instead of Osiris' melee progression (iirc). A high lifesteal + high attackspeed build works okay-ish against a team that doesn't involve 12 seconds of CC or has a crit-heavy assassin/hunter. aka: rarely ever.